but even in those letters he wrote in which he said, oh, you know, all the laws should expire every 20 years, this stuff, blah, blah, blah, it was always in context. it was something that was more practical and more hardheaded, ultimately, than it now seems when we read the one line or two. sure, thank you. same microphone in -- microphone? >> um, this reminds me of n a strange way, of, you know, jefferson's view as a renaissance man reminds me of, strangely enough, of the 1988 presidential campaign between dukakis and bush 41. >> i get that all the time. [laughter] >> i mean, but, you know, at that time i was a professor of mathematics at the university of massachusetts in amherst, and i remember bush who had graduated from yale boasting how he got an f in chemistry. and dukakis coming back weakly that, well, he only got a d in physics. >> right. >> and then at the same time i was reading from jefferson's library of america. there he is in 1789 writing a letter, he was awarded a honorary doctor of law degree from harvard university, but he was live anything france. >> right. >> so he